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Q. I think it's the most practical, open and free of the communist systems.
Worker control of the means of production on the context of a market economy appears sound policy.
Your take on it?
@ Miwa: As it's owned by the collective of the workers and they garnish their income from the results of their cooperative, odds are it's better managed than capitalistic enterprise.
@ Farmer: Yugoslavia is the end result of centuries-old tribal and ethnic hatred, not the end result of market socialism.
Yugoslavia had an economic crisis in the late seventies, just like everyone else except the oil oligarchs.
Worker control of the means of production on the context of a market economy appears sound policy.
Your take on it?
@ Miwa: As it's owned by the collective of the workers and they garnish their income from the results of their cooperative, odds are it's better managed than capitalistic enterprise.
@ Farmer: Yugoslavia is the end result of centuries-old tribal and ethnic hatred, not the end result of market socialism.
Yugoslavia had an economic crisis in the late seventies, just like everyone else except the oil oligarchs.
Answer
Well I was born and lived half of my life in the ex Yugoslavia.
The things were very black an white. On one hand, it was really cool to have free health care for everyone, totally free schools, including colleges and all the universities, free social security, pensions and all that...
On the other hand, it still WAS a totalitarian country. Speak against the government and you could wake up in a nice barb-wired courtyard on an island somewhere far out on the sea where you went through a very rigorous program of systematic physical abuse and brainwashing. Have you read "1984", the book where the idea of Big Brother comes from? Those things really did happen. They weren't pretty.
Goli Otok was one of the places like that: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Goli_otok
But that article on Wiki doesn't really give you an idea what went on in there.
Worker control and part-ownership is a great idea in theory, but it didn't work so idealistically well in real life. You always get some people who are lazy and want to get the same share as everyone else without working so much; and you always get some people who are greedy, work more but try to get more wealth, too. Social differentiation is inevitable. And if the political system doesn't provide a vent for all those desires, they happen illegally. Even in that system, there were people who got very rich by abusing the poor. There were the laws and the system for the poor, and the rich were usually above them.
Another thing: the closed-in market economy meant hardly any import and export. I don't know about you but I like to wake up to a cup of coffee (imported from Brazil), eat some chocolate (imported from Switzerland), get dressed and put on my jeans (imported from Italy) and drive to work in my car (imported from France or Germany).
Under the ex Yu, you didn't have all that. You had tasteless locally produced coffee-substitute, home made cookies, jeans that were OUTRAGEOUSLY expensive because they were smuggled from Italy illegally and you had "Yugo" brand of cars. That was it. No choice at all.
Don't get me wrong, Yu had its good points. Living there was pretty easy. You didn't have to work nowhere nearly as much as we do now in capitalism. Everything was much more... leisurely.
If you worked in a state-owned company you could pretty much fall asleep at work and you were in no danger of loosing your job cause the syndicate organizations were so strong (and they owned the company anyway) that you wouldn't get fired. This kinda impaired productivity a bit sometimes, though.
Just like Miwa said, if something belongs to everoyne, it belongs to noone- Everyone will use and abuse it, but nobody will take care of it, repair it, maintain it.
That's how factories got neglected, the machines broke down and people didn't care to repair them. "They belong to everyone, let somebody else do it."
On the other hand, people were idealistic. There were a lot of voluntary actions, such as building railways and similar - you went there just because you were SO SURE that the country you lived in was the best, and deserved your work even if you didn't get paid, and you wanted to help the country and the people and you loved Tito and everyone was one big happy family. Yup, that's how far the brainwashing got to you. But you actually didn't mind, cause it was FUN. A bit like the Americans nowadays, they are still dead sure they live in the country of the free and the brave, despite Guantanamo and economy downfall and censorship of the media.
Blaaah, what a novel. :)
Anyway, if you want any more info about living in a socialist country from firsthand experience, message me.
Well I was born and lived half of my life in the ex Yugoslavia.
The things were very black an white. On one hand, it was really cool to have free health care for everyone, totally free schools, including colleges and all the universities, free social security, pensions and all that...
On the other hand, it still WAS a totalitarian country. Speak against the government and you could wake up in a nice barb-wired courtyard on an island somewhere far out on the sea where you went through a very rigorous program of systematic physical abuse and brainwashing. Have you read "1984", the book where the idea of Big Brother comes from? Those things really did happen. They weren't pretty.
Goli Otok was one of the places like that: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Goli_otok
But that article on Wiki doesn't really give you an idea what went on in there.
Worker control and part-ownership is a great idea in theory, but it didn't work so idealistically well in real life. You always get some people who are lazy and want to get the same share as everyone else without working so much; and you always get some people who are greedy, work more but try to get more wealth, too. Social differentiation is inevitable. And if the political system doesn't provide a vent for all those desires, they happen illegally. Even in that system, there were people who got very rich by abusing the poor. There were the laws and the system for the poor, and the rich were usually above them.
Another thing: the closed-in market economy meant hardly any import and export. I don't know about you but I like to wake up to a cup of coffee (imported from Brazil), eat some chocolate (imported from Switzerland), get dressed and put on my jeans (imported from Italy) and drive to work in my car (imported from France or Germany).
Under the ex Yu, you didn't have all that. You had tasteless locally produced coffee-substitute, home made cookies, jeans that were OUTRAGEOUSLY expensive because they were smuggled from Italy illegally and you had "Yugo" brand of cars. That was it. No choice at all.
Don't get me wrong, Yu had its good points. Living there was pretty easy. You didn't have to work nowhere nearly as much as we do now in capitalism. Everything was much more... leisurely.
If you worked in a state-owned company you could pretty much fall asleep at work and you were in no danger of loosing your job cause the syndicate organizations were so strong (and they owned the company anyway) that you wouldn't get fired. This kinda impaired productivity a bit sometimes, though.
Just like Miwa said, if something belongs to everoyne, it belongs to noone- Everyone will use and abuse it, but nobody will take care of it, repair it, maintain it.
That's how factories got neglected, the machines broke down and people didn't care to repair them. "They belong to everyone, let somebody else do it."
On the other hand, people were idealistic. There were a lot of voluntary actions, such as building railways and similar - you went there just because you were SO SURE that the country you lived in was the best, and deserved your work even if you didn't get paid, and you wanted to help the country and the people and you loved Tito and everyone was one big happy family. Yup, that's how far the brainwashing got to you. But you actually didn't mind, cause it was FUN. A bit like the Americans nowadays, they are still dead sure they live in the country of the free and the brave, despite Guantanamo and economy downfall and censorship of the media.
Blaaah, what a novel. :)
Anyway, if you want any more info about living in a socialist country from firsthand experience, message me.
What do yall think about these k98 Mauser rifles?
basskiller
Hey I want to get a k98 not for collecting i want one for shooting and hunting so what do you think of theses? http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=204836574 http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=204707428 http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=204650836#PIC http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=204894944#PIC What do yall think of Mitchell's Mausers ? Thanks!!!!
Answer
Mitchell's Mausers = avoid. It's like going to a used car dealership that sells cars that look like new for dirt cheap. If it looks too good to be true, it is...it's a fraud.
As for the others:
1st one - Russian capture, so the markings may have been changed. Kind of kills the history of the gun.
2nd one - Nice one, but no matching #s. Probably a good shooter.
3rd one - Matching numbers, but a capture.
4th one - Not matching numbers, but probably also a good shooter.
The 4th one shows no signs of pitting on the receiver (compared to the second), so that would be my choice of the four. And if you're going to get a 98k, you might as well get one that has the original markings intact. I know you're not looking for a collector gun, but if you want a Mauser strictly to shoot and nothing else, save yourself some money and get a Yugo Mauser 24/47 for cheaper than a 98k can be purchased for...
http://www.jgsales.com/product_info.php/rifles/mausers/p/yugoslavian-24-47-mauser-rifle%2C-matching-bolt%2C-8mm-/cPath/209_217/products_id/1334?osCsid=c3705dcb48f6af150e285a2f285e31f8
Mitchell's Mausers = avoid. It's like going to a used car dealership that sells cars that look like new for dirt cheap. If it looks too good to be true, it is...it's a fraud.
As for the others:
1st one - Russian capture, so the markings may have been changed. Kind of kills the history of the gun.
2nd one - Nice one, but no matching #s. Probably a good shooter.
3rd one - Matching numbers, but a capture.
4th one - Not matching numbers, but probably also a good shooter.
The 4th one shows no signs of pitting on the receiver (compared to the second), so that would be my choice of the four. And if you're going to get a 98k, you might as well get one that has the original markings intact. I know you're not looking for a collector gun, but if you want a Mauser strictly to shoot and nothing else, save yourself some money and get a Yugo Mauser 24/47 for cheaper than a 98k can be purchased for...
http://www.jgsales.com/product_info.php/rifles/mausers/p/yugoslavian-24-47-mauser-rifle%2C-matching-bolt%2C-8mm-/cPath/209_217/products_id/1334?osCsid=c3705dcb48f6af150e285a2f285e31f8
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